Causes lots of Problems in my Relationships with Conservative Christians

- by Mo Johnson (Montclair)

This was written by a pastor I know, but I feel the same way. It causes lots of problems in my relationships with conservative Christians when I feel compelled to speak up about the lies they too often support:

"God's wrath fills me when I see Pulpit Freedom Sunday and all the emails I get from right-wing preachers promoting birtherism and Muslim conspiracy theories involving Obama. I'm not angry out of solidarity with Obama. He actually annoys the crap out of me with his spinelessness when I cut through all the mockery with which he's been treated by people who purport to be Christian.

I'm angry out of solidarity with God and out of shame for the way that His name has been thoroughly compromised because what these preachers are doing is blasphemy of the Holy Spirit. I don't think blasphemy of the Holy Spirit is reducible to simply "saying no to salvation." It's willfully putting sewage in the same spring that dares to proclaim, "Thus saith the Lord." That's why Jesus says to get yourself a millstone necklace if you're going to do that kind of shit."

Comments for Causes lots of Problems in my Relationships with Conservative Christians:

Churches Have Earned the Right to Share Their Political Views -- by Sheila Hansen

You mean kinda like you're doing now with your Facebook pulpit, only you can't take a tax deduction for it? I think churches have earned the right to share their political views. Everyone knows we have liberal churches, where anything goes, and we have conservative churches, where they try to teach a level of morality.

I have issues with both, but I'm not fooling myself into thinking a liberal church could meet my spiritual needs when I know their 'must be kept secret' beliefs. I want to hear the truth, and I will choose what that means for me. Yes I can.

Full of Malicious Racist Lies -- by Mo

You certainly are entitled to believe what you want. This post was about lies that primarily conservative pastors perpetrate. If you think i am perpetrating any lies -- please state with specificity what they are. I'm most interested in hearing and if I am wrong about something, I'll admit it.

You rarely see that from conservatives -- even when confronted with facts proving they are wrong -- they don't care. They will continue to accept and promote the lie. very unchristian. Sorry, but that really is the truth. I could send you hundreds of e-mails I've gotten from "Christian" conservatives full of malicious racist lies. I point it out, they don't care. After all, they "don't believe the liberal media" or "factcheckers."

Recently a conservative clergyman sent out an e-mail saying President Obama was a "half-black, Muslim, socialist Kenyan who should be executed." If those are the folks you want to throw your lot in with -- that is your choice. I praise God I am not in the same boat with them. And, I will always speak out against falsehoods -- as Christians, we must.

Get Lies like that from Conservative "Christians" every day. -- by Mo

Oh, that e-mail was not something i read about -- i got it myself. I get lies like that from conservative "Christians" every day. You would think anyone with intelligence on the conservative side would wonder why the necessity to lie. I mean if one has a strong case to make, it is only weakened by lying.

You Miss the Point -- by Sheila Hansen

I will not attend a liberal church that puts on pretenses of being Christian, anymore than I would attend a conservative church that speaks in the tone you mentioned above. But I do want them to be able to speak freely, so I can choose wisely. By the way, I get the same type of emails from the liberal perspective.

Christians Can and Can't Do -- by Sabrina Stillsmiling

Sheila specifically what. "Liberal" churches are you speaking of? The bible is very clear on what we as Christians can and cannot do, Jesus added one more commandment, that we should LOVE one another...if you are referring to the "liberal" church loving homosexuals, then you should really re read that story in the bible again and get a clear understanding...none of us would get up on a cross and die for humanity so who are we to hate anyone for something that we are not.

Equipt to judge. The bible says Hate the sin, but love the sinner. The christian conservative church has a ong ugly history of hate, racism, sexism and biased. And lastly the bible says we should render unto ceaser that which is his (pay taxes) but nowhere does it give the church to politicize Gods word, even going so far.as to say separate yourself from the world (paraphrasing).

This isn't the "churches" world..this story has already been written, by hating each other we are.breaking the commandment that was MOST IMPORTANT, TO love one another. To take care of the sick, elderly and children. The so called liberal church isn't condoning "do what you want" but it has realized that the only way to win souls is through love. If this is what you hate, I will pray you and love you anyhow.

Don't Fall into the Trap of False Equivalence -- by Mo

Yes, and Sheila, what are the "secret beliefs" of liberal Christian churches that you refer to?

And, please don't fall into the trap of false equivalence. The liberal side is NOTHING like the conservative side when it comes to spreading lies. It just doesn't work with liberals since liberals question and test everything for themselves. Liberals are devoted to finding facts, to science, etc. -- so lies don't work with liberals -- generally speaking.

You might get liberal emails that spin facts, yes. But you won't get liberal emails that just have stupid lies in them. you will get that often from the conservative side. Cause it works with their base. The conservative base readily simply dismisses facts they don't agree with.

This is not a page for me -- by Daniel Keith

This is not a page for me. Someone has appointed themselves above the word.

What you would like the "word" to say? -- by Mo

It would be helpful if you were more specific. what exactly do you have a problem with? Me thinks the issue is what you would like the "word" to say. We are committed to as closely adhering to the teachings and values of the Word (Jesus) as we can.

Christianity? Politics? Don't mix! -- by Keith Romeyn

I'm Not saying, Christians shouldn't VOTE! I'm saying that the Paster, Priest,or what ever? "SHOULD NOT PREACH AGAINST OTHER RELIGIOUS BELIEFS!" First off?

America is a country of MANY Religious Belief's! All walks of LIFE! Let it BE! The other thing? That should not be mentioned in CHURCH? Is a persons way to VOTE! Leave this out of you're serman! This is a part of a Person's CHOICE! If I'm a Baptist? I shouldn't VOTE for a Catholic, Running for President? Even though He, Or She May have the right direction for the Country as a Whole? Enough of this CRAP! Our choice? Is Personal!

I truly Don't believe God will condemn me to HELL, for my "VOTING OF OUR PRESIDENT!" My Question to all you Pasters, Priests? Rabie's? Is? Was Jesus a conservative,or a Liberal? Personally? I believe he was a SOCIALIEST! AH? FEED THE HUNGRY? CLOTH THE NAKED? SHELTER THE HOMELESS? "LOOK AFTER OUR FELLOW MAN AS THY BROTHER?" ARE THESE NOT SOCIALIEST VALUES?

Are these not words of GOD? Did I miss something along the way? Is it not better to give then to receive? Give it a BREAK! It turned my stummit, When My Daughter came to me and said? "GOD" TOLD HER TO VOTE FOR "GEORGE W. BUSH Jr" YES! GOD WILL TALK TO US! But?

Pasters will BRAIN WASH ONE TOO! THATS? ONE OF THE REASONS I LEFT THE CHURCH! Pasters, Priests and Rab'ies? Have gotten OVER THE LINE! No Place for this in Church! One Goes to church to "HEAR THE WORD OF GOD"! NOT FOR POLICTAL CHOICE!!!!!! A-MEN TO THAT!

The Gospel is Very Social -- by Timothy K. Heinrichs

This is TOO tempting. Yes, the gospel is very social, but it is not socialist. Me, personally, am call to help and love, not my government. God's government will as a matter of coarse. Raise your hand if you want God as your KING.

BUT if that is so, then all other religions will have to go away. What you don't like that?

Hypocrisy Most Clearly Seen -- by Mo Johnson

Well, I certainly agree with that Bernhard. One of the problems I have with conservative "Christian" churches is their hypocrisy most clearly seen when they preach about the alleged sins they see in others but fail to mention the obvious and perhaps more grave sins of the self-righteous people sitting in the pews.

Are they now -- by Timothy K. Heinrichs

We will not mention the self-righteous people not in the pews. Being self-righteous is worldly, but part of the human condition. Make Christ the hope and righteousness to stand behind, every thing then is good.

Specifics about political issues -- by Mo

Any specifics about political issues (other than homosexuality and abortion which we've discussed elsewhere) that you think the left is wrong about?

How does a person come into Politics -- by Timothy K. Heinrichs

Mo - As I see the "LEFT", the left wants to make the left rich, richer. How does a person come into politics with less than $100,000 to their name, come out with over $100,000,000. They only are on record making $150,000 a year.

Why is it that American Red Cross can transfer 90% or more of the donations to help the needy and Government can only transfer 50% of the social budget to help those in need? If I am going to give to the poor say $1000.00, let me see. Am I going to give that money to the government or to American Red Cross?

I will help more people with the American Red Cross. Now if I look at the Mennonite Central Committee (MCC), $950.00 goes to helping the poor. (I included MCC because they are part of the right wing, conservative, self-righteous church you were saying you were against.)

Now the Southern Baptist Convention is better, but they don't pay their people as well. I think I would rather put my money with the conservatives.

Good Examples of Conservatives -- by Mo

Timothy and Bernhard -- you guys are good examples of conservatives. You are factually wrong about nearly everything. The world is simply different in reality than how you perceive it. If it was as you perceive, I would agree with you. It simply is not. Here's a few facts.

First, the American Red Cross is a quasi-governmental agency receiveing much support and guidance from the federal government.

Second, the Federal government provides health care at a MUCH more efficient cost than the private sector. Medicare, for example, has only a 3 % administrative cost. Private health insurance plans average over 15%.

Third, the vast majority of money given to churches in America does not go to helping the poor. Only a tiny fraction goes to that. Over 95% goes to pay for buildings and salaries.

You might get your wish -- by Timothy K. Heinrichs

Well, Mo, you might get your wish. And maybe the history of a Thousand Year will not repeat itself. But I have not read where it doesn't. When people take care of their neighbors, everything is good. When people depend on government to take care of them, things go bad really fast.

Show me one example -- by Jimmie Williams

B.S. Show me one example thaty isn't biased.

History of a Thousand Year -- by Mo

Jimmie Williams are you directing that comment toward's Timothy K. Heinrichs comment? If so, I'd also like to hear more from him about what he's talking about with the "history of a Thousand Year" thing...